diff --git a/changelogs/unreleased/9743-Joeavaikath b/changelogs/unreleased/9743-Joeavaikath
new file mode 100644
index 000000000..d5f5d6e76
--- /dev/null
+++ b/changelogs/unreleased/9743-Joeavaikath
@@ -0,0 +1 @@
+Fix wildcard expansion when includes is empty and excludes has wildcards
diff --git a/pkg/controller/backup_controller.go b/pkg/controller/backup_controller.go
index 335becdb8..490c79aed 100644
--- a/pkg/controller/backup_controller.go
+++ b/pkg/controller/backup_controller.go
@@ -570,6 +570,13 @@ func (b *backupReconciler) prepareBackupRequest(ctx context.Context, backup *vel
 		}
 	}
 
+	// Empty IncludedNamespaces means "include all namespaces". Normalize
+	// to ["*"] so that downstream wildcard expansion does not collapse
+	// an empty-includes + wildcard-excludes combination into "back up nothing".
+	if len(request.Spec.IncludedNamespaces) == 0 {
+		request.Spec.IncludedNamespaces = []string{"*"}
+	}
+
 	// validate the included/excluded namespaces
 	for _, err := range collections.ValidateNamespaceIncludesExcludes(request.Spec.IncludedNamespaces, request.Spec.ExcludedNamespaces) {
 		request.Status.ValidationErrors = append(request.Status.ValidationErrors, fmt.Sprintf("Invalid included/excluded namespace lists: %v", err))
diff --git a/pkg/controller/backup_controller_test.go b/pkg/controller/backup_controller_test.go
index 030ef9cdd..c65f1d15d 100644
--- a/pkg/controller/backup_controller_test.go
+++ b/pkg/controller/backup_controller_test.go
@@ -320,6 +320,34 @@ func TestBackupLocationLabel(t *testing.T) {
 	}
 }
 
+func TestPrepareBackupRequest_EmptyIncludedNamespacesNormalizedToWildcard(t *testing.T) {
+	formatFlag := logging.FormatText
+	logger := logging.DefaultLogger(logrus.DebugLevel, formatFlag)
+
+	apiServer := velerotest.NewAPIServer(t)
+	discoveryHelper, err := discovery.NewHelper(apiServer.DiscoveryClient, logger)
+	require.NoError(t, err)
+
+	backupLocation := builder.ForBackupStorageLocation("velero", "loc-1").Result()
+	fakeClient := velerotest.NewFakeControllerRuntimeClient(t, backupLocation)
+
+	c := &backupReconciler{
+		discoveryHelper:       discoveryHelper,
+		kbClient:              fakeClient,
+		defaultBackupLocation: backupLocation.Name,
+		clock:                 &clock.RealClock{},
+		formatFlag:            formatFlag,
+	}
+
+	backup := defaultBackup().Result()
+	backup.Spec.IncludedNamespaces = nil
+
+	res := c.prepareBackupRequest(ctx, backup, logger)
+	defer res.WorkerPool.Stop()
+
+	assert.Equal(t, []string{"*"}, res.Spec.IncludedNamespaces)
+}
+
 func Test_prepareBackupRequest_BackupStorageLocation(t *testing.T) {
 	var (
 		defaultBackupTTL      = metav1.Duration{Duration: 24 * 30 * time.Hour}
@@ -709,11 +737,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.True(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:          velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -749,11 +777,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  "alt-loc",
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.False(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:          velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -793,11 +821,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  "read-write",
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.True(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:          velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -834,11 +862,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					TTL:                              metav1.Duration{Duration: 10 * time.Minute},
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.False(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:          velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -875,11 +903,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.True(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:          velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -917,11 +945,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.False(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:          velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -959,11 +987,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.True(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:          velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -1001,11 +1029,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.True(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:          velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -1043,11 +1071,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.False(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:          velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -1086,11 +1114,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.True(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:               velerov1api.BackupPhaseFailed,
@@ -1129,11 +1157,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.True(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:               velerov1api.BackupPhaseFailed,
@@ -1172,11 +1200,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.False(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.True(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:                       velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -1216,11 +1244,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.False(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:                       velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -1260,11 +1288,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.False(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:                       velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -1304,11 +1332,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.False(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.True(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:                       velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -1349,11 +1377,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.False(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.False(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:                       velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -1393,11 +1421,11 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.False(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.True(),
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   autoExcludeClusterScopedResources,
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources,
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:                       velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -1441,13 +1469,13 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.False(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.True(),
 					IncludedClusterScopedResources:   []string{"storageclasses"},
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   append([]string{"clusterroles"}, autoExcludeClusterScopedResources...),
 					IncludedNamespaceScopedResources: []string{"pods"},
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: append([]string{"secrets"}, autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources...),
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:                       velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
@@ -1491,13 +1519,13 @@ func TestProcessBackupCompletions(t *testing.T) {
 				},
 				Spec: velerov1api.BackupSpec{
 					StorageLocation:                  defaultBackupLocation.Name,
+					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 					DefaultVolumesToFsBackup:         boolptr.False(),
 					SnapshotMoveData:                 boolptr.True(),
 					IncludedClusterScopedResources:   []string{"storageclasses"},
 					ExcludedClusterScopedResources:   append([]string{"clusterroles"}, autoExcludeClusterScopedResources...),
 					IncludedNamespaceScopedResources: []string{"pods"},
 					ExcludedNamespaceScopedResources: append([]string{"secrets"}, autoExcludeNamespaceScopedResources...),
-					IncludedNamespaces:               []string{"*"},
 				},
 				Status: velerov1api.BackupStatus{
 					Phase:                       velerov1api.BackupPhaseFinalizing,
diff --git a/pkg/util/wildcard/expand.go b/pkg/util/wildcard/expand.go
index ec572f359..2d35e5dd5 100644
--- a/pkg/util/wildcard/expand.go
+++ b/pkg/util/wildcard/expand.go
@@ -19,6 +19,11 @@ func ShouldExpandWildcards(includes []string, excludes []string, fromBackup bool
 		return false
 	}
 
+	// Empty includes is equivalent to * (match all) - don't expand
+	if len(includes) == 0 {
+		return false
+	}
+
 	wildcardFound := false
 	for _, include := range includes {
 		if containsWildcardPattern(include) {
diff --git a/pkg/util/wildcard/expand_test.go b/pkg/util/wildcard/expand_test.go
index 4d1d68761..9851106da 100644
--- a/pkg/util/wildcard/expand_test.go
+++ b/pkg/util/wildcard/expand_test.go
@@ -90,6 +90,12 @@ func TestShouldExpandWildcards(t *testing.T) {
 			fromBackup: true,
 			expected:   false,
 		},
+		{
+			name:     "empty includes with wildcard excludes - should not expand",
+			includes: []string{},
+			excludes: []string{"ns*"},
+			expected: false,
+		},
 		{
 			name:       "complex wildcard patterns",
 			includes:   []string{"*-prod"},